[Note: I noticed many people come here to find out whether or not there is a connection between Passages treatment centers and Scientology or the Narconon treatment centers affiliated with the Scientology movement. My opinion is that Passages has nothing to do with Scientology. The founders of Passages haven’t indicated any connection that I have heard. I have a close friend who attended and has said nothing about Scientology. And I see no reason to believe they are affiliated. In fact, I see a powerful indicator that they would never be affiliated. As you may or may not know, the scientologists don’t hold psychiatry/therapy in high regard. In fact, they seem to hate the whole field. Passages and the Prentiss family, on the other hand, seem to love modern psychiatry/therapy. In their book, The Alcoholism and Addiction Cure, they recommend a laundry list of therapists that you’ll need in order to maintain recovery / address the “underlying causes of addiction.” In Scientology, most of what normal people would go to therapists and psychiatrists for help with is addressed with what the scientologists call “auditing.” Thus, if Passages were a back door to Scientology, it would be a piss poor one, since it actively directs people toward “auditing’s” competition. Yes, Passages invests heavily in the whole “toxins” thing, and that should be a red flag – but plenty of people who know nothing about scientology believe in this toxin nonsense. I think some people may also believe there is a scientology link because Passages espouses the belief that addiction is not a disease, and they have this in common with Narconon. There are plenty of people who hold this view, and again, know nothing about scientology. Then, there are supposed call scripts for those working the addiction help lines for Narconon. Some dedicated anti-scientology folks found and published these scripts in which the telemarketer makes a point to put down Narconon’s competition, specifically mentioning Passages (LINK). While I hold a low opinion of Passages and I do not think they offer a good solution, and in fact I think their focus on “underlying causes/conditions” is counterproductive – I still have no reason to believe that they are affiliated with Narconon or Scientology. added 4/7/14]
I’m constantly warning my readers to avoid the path of conventional addiction treatment programs, so I’m sure that many of you hop on google and search for ‘alternative addiction treatments’ to go to or send your loved ones to. Unfortunately, most of what you’ll find in the way of alternative treatments aren’t the alternative at all, they’re usually the same old same ol’, or packed with an even higher degree of mysticism and spiritual mumbo jumbo. In this series, I’ll expose the fakes for what they are, and clue you in to the warning signs which should raise red flags and let you know that you’re being marketed more of the same – snake oil.
To find an alternative to anything, you must establish a baseline of what is the norm. Fortunately (and unfortunately) it’s easy to see what is the norm in addiction treatment. Most treatment programs in this country believe that addiction is a disease which causes compulsive substance use. All 12 step programs also adhere to the same disease theory, and fully 95% of treatment programs either teach the 12-steps explicitly, bring you to 12-step meetings during your stay, or strongly advise that you attend 12-step groups as ‘aftercare’ for your treatment. So, the disease theory is the norm, it is at the core of conventional treatment methods, and most programs have the stated goal of teaching their clients this theory. Moreover, there are myriad ideas which have logically sprung from and follow this theory – such as learning how to ‘cope’ with your disease, being in lifelong recovery rather than becoming recovered, paranoia over so-called ‘triggers’, relapse as a part of recovery, and so on.
The disease theory is false. It is unproven. It is bad science. Furthermore, the treatment offered for the disease has failed at showing any positive results. People go in and out of treatment programs all the time without finding success. The public has begun to catch on, and the treatment centers have followed, thus they’ve rebranded, offering “alternatives” to conventional treatment. But like a salad at a fast food restaurant which contains more fat and calories than a cheeseburger, these alternatives are just more of the same garbage.
To spot a fake alternative you’ve gotta examine the essential conceptual flaws of the disease theory. In reality, addiction is made up of a string of poor choices and beliefs which lead the addict to view altered states of consciousness as being better and more enjoyable than simply being in touch with reality and working for your own happiness. The disease theory throws out this possibility, and claims that the addicts behavior is the result of something beyond their volitional control, that it comes from a mysterious ‘disease’. The disease theory robs the substance abuser of the chance to see that they are creating their own problems, and provides an excuse: “I’m diseased”. The susbstance abuser then sees their desire for heavy substance abuse as an inevitable fact of life, something they will always have, that they must live with forever, and that they will periodically succumb to. They see it as out of their control, caused by an external force.
Now, any concept which likewise places the responsibility for the substance abuser’s behavior outside of their own decision making process, outside of their free will – will be just as damaging as the disease theory, and is in fact, simply the disease theory under a different name. Today, I was looking at the website of a well known and aggressively marketed “alternative” treatment program, Passages, which claims to disagree with the disease theory, as they say:
We do not believe in the concept that alcoholism and addiction are diseases and worse, incurable diseases. We do not talk to you or your loved one about “your incurable disease.” That is destructive, untrue, and deprives you of hope.
But then they go on to say that they examine “the vitamin and mineral content in each client’s body to determine if there is any deficiency that may be causing him or her to self-medicate.” So right there, they’ve tipped their hat. They’ve told us in one breath that they don’t believe the disease theory, and in the next breath they tell us that vitamin deficiencies are causing the substance abusers behavior. Conceptually, this idea is analogous to, and as dangerous, as the disease theory itself. Then they list a bunch of health conditions (such as fatigue, anxiety, and headaches) and their relations to vitamin deficiencies and state that:
Any of the above conditions can be the direct cause of our using drugs or alcohol to cope with the feelings that arise within us from those conditions. Failure to correct those deficiencies will almost always lead to failure of treatment and later relapse.
And now we’re getting the picture that these people don’t just think it’s a good side issue to address nutrition, they actually believe that vitamin deficiencies cause addiction. This places the problem of substance abuse outside of the realm of conscious volitional decision-making, and into an external realm of “things my body makes me do”. Of course, they have solutions for this:
Passages offers acupressure, acupuncture, Swedish massage, deep tissue, and Reiki (energy cleansing). The purpose of these types of bodywork is to relieve our bodies from physical pain, and to clear our fatty tissues and muscle tissues from toxins that have been left behind from our alcoholism or drug use.
Drugs and alcohol flow through our blood stream leaving behind unhealthy substances that are stored in our muscle and fatty tissues. In addition to this, our muscles have memory that can hold onto trauma and that can later cause us physical pain and even relapse. It is essential for successful treatment that we obtain release from past trauma and from the toxins that we have stored in our bodies. At Passages we use ancient and modern techniques to stimulate the three hundred sixty-one tsubos (pressure points) along the body’s fourteen meridians (nerve pathways or channels through which the body’s energy flows) to bring relief to our clients, improve circulation to the organs, balance energy, relieve tension, release stored toxin from the cells, and improve all bodily functions. If the toxins are not released and old trauma addressed, relapse is far more likely. We provide four one-hour bodywork sessions each week. Passages is the only residential treatment center that includes all those essential treatment components as part of our program.
“TOXINS” is a HUGE red flag. When someone tells you that your addiction will be cured by removing toxins from your body – run the other way fast. Your muscles hold bad memories that cause relapse? Three hundred sixty psubos? This is mystical mumbo jumbo. There is no doubt in my mind that physical health can make life easier & improve your mood, and that this will spill over to some degree into your mental health and ability to make better decisions, but these people are not saying that, they’re saying that your problem will be solved by addressing nutrition and bad energy and getting massaged. These people are not offering an alternative to conventional treatment or the disease theory itself – they are giving you a nearly identical poison: the idea that toxins, bad energy, and vitamin deficiencies are causing your behavior. You are causing your behavior. You can change it with clear thinking. Go find a true alternative program, one that offers constructive ideas based in reality, I’ve got some listed on my help page.
Unless you are a medical doctor of some sort, I (personally) think it is potentially dangerous to write advice on how an alcoholic or addict should handle their addiction, seeing as it is a matter of life and death.
I do, however, recognize your concern and appreciate you wishing to help people.
-Phil
Interesting that the commenter frames disagreement with the site by saying anyone who isn’t a doctor shouldn’t comment on the addiction/recovery industry, when the addiction/recovery industry is centered on the idea that a bunch of people who identify themselves as having the same problem commenting on their own & each others’ lives is a superior mechanism for diagnosis & treatment of the condition they identify as their problem – And affiliated persons/groups frequently promote advice counter to the orders of doctors (no pain treatment during dental procedures, no antidepressants).
It’s funny how 90% of the actual “work” done at pretty much all the ultra expensive rehabs is done but “therapists” with no advanced university training.
At least in the 12-step fellowships, no one pretends to be a therapist. The value in 12-step recovery is that it emphasized ACTION and continuation of devoting time and energy to maintaining sobriety. It’s totally FREE and an extremely compassionate, empathetic, and supportive environment. The notion that these rehabs can “cure you” or change you in 4-6 weeks, etc is EGREGIOUS. I cannot believe that the FTC does not crack down on these outrageous claims that are often made when trying to garner new customers. I went to an extremely expensive $1000/day rehab and it did NOTHING more than what I got from free rehab (with a waiting list of course) from my local government. I don’t buy into ALL aspects of 12-step programs, but I take all the good things that it does offer and it’s a wonderful way to maintain sobriety.
I am a physician, and I don’t see anything written here that’s factually incorrect. People just don’t like it because it’s flying in the face of 12 Step wisdom.
Actually….addiction is a combo situation between toxins and tolerance yes, AND your behavior which is based on a low responsibility level. Its easy to talk down about something when you don’t have all the facts. I tried all types of 12 step, alternative therapy like acupuncture, the whole legal drug dealing thing with doctors, etc., and Narconon is the only thing that worked because they actually use the combo model. Spirituality (for you AA fans) is included in their 7th and 8th dynamics of what you need to improve on and address in your life. Scientology is not a religion; its the study of science. And yes, unless you get those toxins out of your body….you will have cravings. Hence..the sauna part of their program. Success rate…75%. (Speaking from both experience and as a Registered Addiction Specialist). And I am not getting paid to advertise.
LMAO! Not a single shred of evidence from the Scilon making the wacky claims.
Bottom line different things work for different people. None of them should be condemned. Should be if this doesn’t work try this. The whole idea is to save or improve lives. So forget about ideology and concentrate on what works best for the individual
No it is NOT because PASSAGES FLIES IN THE FACE OF 12 STEP WISDOM,IT IS THE IMPLICATION
Before I was rudely interrupted, It is NOT because it as the dr. said “flies in the face of twelve step wisdom” It is because Passages implies that twelve step does not work.Probably because it is free. I have been a therapist for three decades,and sober longer than that. there is no cure. Once an addict,always an addict. But you do not have to struggle. Sobriety is an attitude However,that said,I am of the opinion whatever works. People say AA did not work for them. Fine. That is because they did not WANT it to work at the time. By the way,it is not a religious cult. I am a rock ribbed atheist. There are two things that do not work in addiction treatment. 1) The coddling received in these country club rehabs and 2) Psychiatry Psychiatry has no business in the treatment of alcoholism,in particular. It hangs a mentally ill label on people they do not deserve, Then they treat the perceived mental problem Psychiatry assumes that all addicts are mentally ill. To make that assumption,you must also assume that all mentally ill people are addicts. NOT TRUE! Many shrinks go into addiction because it is easy work,and a simple way to justify all those little letters behind their name. Mental illness in addicts,is caused by their addiction.,not the other way around.
Hi Dave,
Your opinion on the nature of addiction is unclear to me from what you’ve posted.
1. Do you believe that it is a disease?
2. Do you believe that it is something that can be treated?
3. You have defined problems of treatment – does this mean you also think there are effective treatments in existence?
Just asking, because you’ve said some provocative things I’d like to respond to, but I want to make sure I’m clear on where you’re coming from first.
-Steven
Dave, thank you. 12 Step programs may be flawed in some ways, but in none I’ve ever seen. AA saved my life. For now. I’m not as closed minded as to refuse to accept that there are other approaches to addiction, but it is irresponsible to suggest to people that addiction can be cured. It can’t. People with diabetes take insulin. A person with cardiovascular disease has to keep from putting a spoon of salt on their cornflakes. The most dangerous aspect of the whole Passages approach in my opinion is that it suggests casting it into an area that is very easily monetized to a ridiculous extreme. I am always cautious about people who are willing to stand up and exclaim to the world that they have absolute certainty that they are right and everyone else is wrong. Just to hear this young man from Passages speak out in TV commercials that “I was an addict for 10 years and now I’m not…” I’ve lost many friends who have said those exact same words and in the end, wound up in the same place they were before after one relapse. This poor guy is playing a very dangerous game and I hope he is lucky enough to prove me wrong.
Reply to Dave
Hi Dave
I am a dual diagnosis therapist, many letters after my name. And you are partly correct, sometimes people just use for no real reason, but the majority of people who are using are using for a reason, self medicating, don’t want to remember something, numb the pain. My work is to help folks deal with their issues and what ends up happening they don’t need or want the substance as much. Or I have seen people heal, and just quit using. Oh and as far as getting into this because its easy, I think working with folks with substance issues is one of the most challenging parts of my job. It is multifaceted, so there is so much to work through. Mental health issues, doesn’t necessarily imply severe mental illness. Take good care
Dave, I agree with a lot of what you say, to the extent I understand it. But, sorry, your statement that if psychiatrists believe addicts are mentally ill, then they must also say that everyonewith a mental illness is also an addict, is flat out false. Not only that, but it demonstrates your ability to think logically is virtually non-existent (not saying you can’t think logically, but that statement creates that impression). Some people think addiction is one type of mental illness. No one says people suffering from bi-polar disease, schizophrenia, OCD must necessarily be an addict of addicts are considered mentally ill. According to you, everyone who is bi polar is also a schizophrenic, or everyone with depression is a schizophrenic.
Take any other class of diseases, such as cancer. Lung cancer is a type of cancer just as addiction is a type of mental illness. Prostrate cancer is a very different type of cancer, just as schizophrenia is a different type of mental illness. According to your logic, if patients with lung cancer are labeled as cancer patients, then all cancer patients must have lung cancer.
See the difference?
No It is not because it defies 12 step that I don’t like it,it is because they promise a ‘cure’. ‘I was an addict for ten years,now I’m not.” the ad says.
Another ad says. “This is not a twelve step program,this actually works.” Implying that AA or related programs do not.
I have heard it my whole sober life(over thirty years) AA did not work for me. There is only one reason for that. You did not want sobriety bad enough. AA did not work because you did not want it to.
And Acupuncture will? what a joke All Passages,or any other country rehab is interested in,is,making a profit. They don’t give a damn about the client as long as they their thirty grand for a 28 day stay.
I have been a recovery therapist for most of my sober life. Fancy rehabs,that spoil already spoiled people who already think they are special,does not work.
Yeah, people consume copious amounts of narcotics risking death every day, along with often attempting suicide is because they think they’re so SPECIAL. Nothing to do with self-hatred, low self-esteem, trauma, etc. Get the fuck of this page. You are pathetic and an insult to humanity.
I’m curious as to whether you have ever had an addiction?
Hi Nick,
Is your question directed at me, the author of this blog? If so, you can find the answer to that question very simply, by looking at the “about” page. Either way, I’ll give you my updated answer to the question of whether I’ve “ever had an addiction”:
Yes and no.
Yes, there was a time in my life where I felt and behaved in a way commonly known as “having an addiction.” All I wanted to do was inject a constant stream of cocaine and heroin into my veins and feel the repeated rushes of those drugs. I wanted it so much that I stole from my family to get drugs, sold my possessions to get drugs, committed countless crimes to get drugs, and chose to dedicate most of my time acquiring and using drugs. While I was in and out of addiction treatment programs I especially felt as if this was the only thing I could do, and as if it had almost ceased to contain any element of choice – i.e. that I was “powerless”.
But NO, I did not have an addiction. When addiction is described as something people can’t control, or that is caused by some internal vulnerability to stress, or that is a mental illness of some sort, or that is caused by any sort of force outside of my own mind and will – no, I did not have that. I don’t think it exists. I think that is a big lie. When I stopped believing in that concept, and started looking to dedicate myself to whatever lifestyle and activities I could find which might make me happier, then I stopped my relentless pursuit of happiness through drugs.
So yes, I behaved in a way that our culture calls addiction, but no, I did not “have an addiction”, because I don’t believe it’s a thing that anyone can have (as currently conceived by treatment experts and the culture at large). I did have physical withdrawal symptoms from heroin, but that’s a separate issue.
-Steven
I Believe your Review of 12 step programs are in error, if you Read thru the !2 Steps of AA you will note that All 12 steps are written the past tense, and living a sober life style are the benefits of the Steps, We are not Powerless!! We WERE powerless, because onless you first hand know the Symtoms of Excessive Drinking and when Taking the First Drink, and Your body CRAVES more, Than you know NOTHING!!!, And you are Dangerous for something you know Very little about , People want a pill that makes it all go away, And people LIE, I Can Garrantee that if you follow what the people that have 20 – 30 -40 years of Sobriety say you will have a life you thought never possible , But people do not want to work at it they want a pill, or lotion , or to blame it on someone else, and people who say that they tried it and It failed , No they Failed , They failed to do the work, They failed to Invest in themselves, < I have seen this time after time , , No body likes Change, Any Change, if you Want Sobriey you'll do the work, If not Then you dont , Bottom line , I'll invite Rebuttel, if I have misspelled , Fat fingers, oh and yes I have 15 years OF CONTINOUS Sobriety
So if someone gets clean in a 12 Step program, it’s because of the program, thus the Steps work…but if they work the Steps and don’t get clean, it’s because they didn’t work the Steps correctly, thus the Steps work? That’s quite the nice little piece of convoluted pretzel logic you’ve got going there.
I beg to differ! I have watched this over thousands of times as an addiction counselor. People that thoroughly work the 12 step program DO RECOVER. I urge the author of this article to look up the definition of disease. Addiction in itself is a mental obsession coupled with a physical allergy. If will power alone worked then there would be hardly any addiction issues. If you look at the recovery rate when AA was in its infancy it was 75%. Today only 3% of those seeking treatment get recovered due to crap like this author is pushing.
No, addiction’s NOT an allergy. Drinking too much has NOTHING to do with histamine release. Just because Bill Wilson regurgitated the rantings of that quack Silkworth doesn’t make it true. The 75% claim is simply the word of stock swindler Bill Wilson; it’s not based in any kind of verifiable fact.
And the numbers show that AA is hilariously ineffective…the success rate doesn’t even outpace spontaneous remission. 12 Step programs fail more people than they help.
My counselor told us the first day of treatment that 9 out of 10 of you will relapse.
You Richard don’t know what the hell you are talking about, these 12 step programs have never ever failed people!! You can think it all you want but it’s because the person didn’t work the program, RARELY have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path, those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not COMPLETELY give themselves to this simple program!! Let me guess you don’t understand what that means, rarely means never never never have they seen anybody fail who has done what AA suggest, and I must say they are suggestions but they are steps that MUST be done to undergo any type of change! AA does work and if you people want to show your ignorance then go ahead
Amen brother! Tried everything! I finally am actually working a solid program the way its supposed to be worked and it’s absolutely revolutionizing me from the inside out! I used to bash AA and said it didnt work for me until I got honest with myself. It works if you work it and its the only thing that will insure long term sobriety if addressed with honesty and humility!
I have 16+ yrs in NA because I work on myself. My spiritual ,mental and physical self. Then I help others and seek a balanced life of work, community, and healing. Those who relapse or say it doesn’t work- IMHO – were lazy unwilling and not honest.
Josh,
You can rant and rave all you want, but allow me to go out on a limb an quote Jay Z real quickly…”Men lie, women lie, numbers don’t”. To suggest that following the twelve steps as prescribed guarantees sobriety is beyond ludicrous. For whatever reason, no more than 10% of those who go to aa stay sober, and that is being generous. Whether they are model students is irrelevant, as a robust, successful process produces positive results regardless of the raw condition of the inputs. So a civilization that possesses the ability to put a nuclear weapon in the left ear of a camel from across the Atlantic Ocean’s best effort when it comes to addiction treatment is a program that bats below the Mendoza line and only works if a member is willing to become a drone? I’m grateful for those it works for…lord knows the world is a better place with fewer people out there in active addiction. But the blind defense of AA as some sort of cure all is misguided and foolish.
You 12 Steppers are all pyschos who drank the Kool-Aid!! One of the main concepts of the 12 Steps is Open Mindedness if I remember my cult info correctly. But good luck finding ONE 12 stepper open minded enough to admit that anything other than their “cult” may possibly work.
I’m one of The open minded 16+ yr clean freaks. I was grateful to find comfort from those who understood me, I stayed away from using rooms as a dating service, and live just for today. At first I thought it was a cult but when I wasn’t using day after day I’d admit “if this is a cult it’s the best thing for me because it works”. I’ve seen people leave and do the church thing, the medical avenue and just abstain. And many have stayed clean. Whatever works. As long as the person needing help finds it somewhere.
If it were an allergy, why don’t we all just start taking Claritin? Problem solved…
So let me get this straight…it’s the author of this blogs fault that AA has an abysmal 3% success rate. Thats the type of logic that should be aborted, or, at least, strangled in its crib. It’s actually perfectly in line with the AA, disease model culture of blame. I didn’t rob my own mother, it was the distortion in my frontal lobe…AA didn’t fail anyone, it was all those liberated, rational thinkers who dared debate the big book. What is this, Stalinist Russia? Give me a freakin break people.
You’re a low life. Nothing better to do then write little blogs hating on 12 step programs. I’ve been clean for 3 years come September and i could not stay clean for more then a week on my own
N.A. saved my life
Jake – You sure don’t sound very happy, joyous, and free. Someone writes a blog citing scientific research and then gives their own take and that makes them a “low life?” NA is perfectly fine for you if it works, but these programs hurt more people than they help regardless of what impact they’ve had in your life. “Nothing better to do?” If you spent any time on Mr. Slate’s blog you’d see that he actually spends quite a bit of time away from here working with people to help them overcome their issues? Something that you would presumably be in favor of? Or do you resent the very notion of the possibility of success outside of NA?
It sounds like someone needs to do steps 4-9 over again with their sponsor so those resentments don’t cause you to start using again. I’m worried about you, Jake. Keep coming back, I guess.
Richard,
Are you a doctor? Cuz I don’t think you mentioned that AT ALL on any of your posts.
Matt
Yes, I am. But this isn’t my real name, if you’re trying to find me 🙂
Hah! Why would I waste my time, Dick? You are of no relevance to me.
Then why are you so angry and spiteful? Typically, an entity that is of no relevance to someone lacks the ability to provoke a pronounced emotional response. Matt, I actually feel bad for picking on you. The fact that you lack the ability to engage in constructive debate or compose level headed, rational arguments is more pitiable than ire inspiring. If aa makes you a better person for yourself and your family, by all means hit it as hard as you can.
Steve,
I am literally about to explode with excitement that Mr. Kevin B. MBA Sir commented on me again!!!! WOOOOO HOOOOOO!
That was me exploding! Guess I’m not level headed, Mr. Kevin B. MBA Sir, cuz my head just exploded with utter delight!
Steve, I’m not sure if I mentioned it, but the look of the new site so feng shui!
Mateo
I have been sober for 20 years. AA rocks!
Jake,
Might as well be effed up if you’re this angry bro. Seems like NA has enabled you to be abstinate from substances, but the insecure, abrasive addict is clearly alive and well. Low life??? For suggesting different options of treatment in a respectful and informed manner? I’d suggest a weak willed junkie who can’t summon the strength to avoid sticking needles in his arms for one week without the comfort of believing his disease is responsible for all his past misgivings while holding grown men’s hands and chanting platitudes more closely resembles a “low life” than the operator of this site.
Don’t bother accusing me of being a hypocrite because I’m obviously angry too. I have no problem being honest, I am angry. Angry at cowardly people who blame anything but themselves for their own sins. Be a man, Jake. Just be a man.
I count over 18 years of continued sobriety on this page. Be proud of how you continue to obtain serenity, whatever the means. God bless
Passages Malibu is most likely a Scientology operation, like Narcanon. The fat storage, the toxins, the vitamins, for profit- all the same.
http://articles.latimes.com/2007/oct/09/local/me-rehab9
Really? You’re as bad as they (Passages)
I worked steps for a while at the strong urging of my addictionologist (she is a doctor and treatment is not her primary business), as well as family, and other people I’ve met along the way. What I found to be true to me is that I don’t have a ‘disease’ or ‘allergy’ or anything else of the such. I took drugs because they were pleasurable, because being high was ten times more blissful than anything else I had experienced in my bipolar life. There are those that believe psychiatry is bogus as well, and that SSRI’s and the like are being pimped by Big Pharma.
And to a certain extent, I agree with them. I always try to base my arguments in facts and this is what I know. I know that Thiothixene turned my father from a hallucinating schizophrenic with voices in his head to a relatively normal, functional man.
I know that on 1,500mg of Divalproex daily, I now rarely swing from vivid mania to deep depression as I used to do. I know that by addressing my mental health, by paying more attention to what my mind and body are telling me, and by avoiding the things that bring back those cravings, I have been able to maintain sobriety from drugs of addiction.
I can still enjoy a few beers and nothing bad happens. If I try to enjoy a few Oxycodone, very bad things happen. By recognizing what I can and cannot maintain self control over, and by taking responsibility over my own poor decision making, I am living a normal and pretty damn skippy life.
When I tried to scapegoat anything other than my own judgment, it was all too easy to relapse and come back in with my tail tucked in and a smirk when nobody was looking. It became a game.
Different strokes for different folks. I think achieving a clean, normal lifestyle is something to be proud of, no matter the method. But I do NOT believe in telling an addict that “this is the ONLY way you will stay clean”. That is what I find to be truly irresponsible. If what you hear sounds like bullshit to you, try something that doesn’t. As long as you try. Don’t sell yourself short.
I see many people here who, clearly, have never studied addiction. It is true that using, and even abusing a substance are choices. However, with continued substance abuse, the brain can be damaged to the point where the element of choice no longer exists – dependence.
Tom,
So it only becomes a disease after a series of conscious choices? Sounds more like the result of a series of a persons actions than a disease they caught out of mid air. Regardless of how it ends, addiction is the product of choices, and on this matter, there is no debate.
Allow me to point out the fact that, while making claims to being a doctor, Richard certainly evinces a complete dirth of knowledge with respect to the medical assessment of addiction and certainly makes claims none of my medical colleagues would. Suffice it to say that AA and reputable treatment facilities make no claim that, as Steven asserts, “relaps is a part of recovery.” That is absolutely untrue. In as much as the book, “Alcoholics Anonymous” refers to Dr. Silkworth’s statement about alcoholism being an allergy, it is careful not to make claims with respect to the soundness of that statement. However, Richard, I find it odd that in your lambaste you fail to recognize the other four histones involved in an allergic response. Can it be an oversight, or are you simply not aware of them? To describe it as an allergic response is something with which neither I, nor my medical colleagues take issue, as it will suffice for laypersons. I know of no person so bold as to claim AA is the singular method for acheiving and maintaining sobriety; however, in seventy-five years no other treatment method has come close to equalling its success rate. Having said that, if the method does not appeal to you then don’t practice it. But, I would employ an abundance of caution before disillusioning people who might just have their lives saved through the ministrations of the good and caring people whose lives have been changed via AA.
Hello Steven,
I am very anti-AA because I know that there are a lot of problems with it. But, like you point out, some people are against AA because of their blind hatred for it. They don’t like it simply because they had a bad experience in the program, or they don’t like their teachings, or for some other reason other that has nothing to do with the fact that there have been proven to be ineffective and harmful. And many of these blind haters of AA also hate Christianity for the same reasons. So they’re just as anti-Christianity as they are anti-AA which is very unfair to Christians like me who are anti-AA.
But it only makes sense to reject religions like AA and any other religion based on good evidence that proves they are deceitful and/or dangerous, or because there is no good evidence to support their beliefs. I’m talking about evidence that would hold up in any fair and honest court of law.
So if Christianity is a valid alternative to AA, the anti-AA movement should not attack it or dismiss it. Of course, there will always be members who don’t like it or believe that it “works”, but it should not be treated like AA by the movement. I am and Christian and I have done a lot for the anti-AA cause. And I’m still active in speaking against AA. So what do you think about Christianity being presented as an alternative to AA? Please let me know. I look forward to hearing from you.
What motivates you to speak out against Alcoholics Anonymous?
I am motivated to speak against AA because it is deceitful and dangerous.
How is AA deceitful and dangerous? The program is simple, and it works. There are people in AA who are deceitful and dangerous, but the program has kept me sober for 32 years. I am a rationalist, and a skeptic. I know too many people of all faiths, or completely atheistic people, who have found release from the torment through the 12 steps. I don’t give a rat’s ass whether it is a mental or physical illness, or an allergic reaction. It is an honest way of life, that when practiced rigorously, leads to a life of competence, with joy and happiness thrown in to boot. Most the people who quit AA will tell you, upon return, it was just “too hard”, because the program requires change for growth. Boo hoo. No one said life is easy. But life is so much better than I ever thought it could be. CULT? No leader – no dues or fees – no requirements for membership other than a desire to stop drinking. No, not a cult – drop the buzzword. cult.
I have found the numerous thoughts and opinions in these responses both interesting and sometimes frustrating. My husband has been in recovery for 30 years. He is of the opinion that his addiction is a disease…that he is in recovery…not recovered. He feels, for him, it is dangerous to think otherwise. If he’s cured than it would follow that he could use without being addicted….a very dangerous concept for someone in recovery! This thinking has worked for him. For those on this board that are in recovery but angry…recovery is a process just as life is. Continue to grow and learn and maybe others that believe your anger is evidence that 12 steps dont work obviously dont understand that it is thise dynamics that make it work! We are all individual in different stages of growth.
It’s through the necessity of learning to accept others, respect others and cooperate with others in the group that help us to grow. Our growth stopped while we were completely enmeshed in the drug and party culture or, in my case, lived with or loved someone who was. AA, NA, Alanon, etc is not a religion. But it does promote a higher power…sometimes that power is in the group itself, that we can be stronger as a group than alone. Sometimes our faith gets as sick as the rest of us from living in the insanity and the spirituality of the steps help us to heal. And yes….the success of recovery depends on working the steps. I’ve known people who used the excuse that “its a religion” or “someone said such and such and I don’t agree so it must be the group that teaches it” as a reason to quit attending. But then, we all resist change and any excuse will do. If you found something that works for you, great. But 12 step programs also work and for a variety of reasons…they work because it requires humility to admit we were powerless and that our lives are a mess. It also takes absolute honesty with self…about your responsibity in your own life and how it’s affected others. And it takes a willingness to make amends and accept that you have caused harm to yourself and others … that trust that has been lost must be earned back. And studying the 12 traditions along with the twelve steps that governs how we deal with and respect others is a very important part of learning to apply the steps. The whole process is about life change and learning to accept life on life’s terms. The many misconceptions about the 12 step programs by those that are anti-12 step is something that encourages those that want an excuse to continue to use rather than giving it a chance. If you have the self-dicipline to quit on your own…more power to you. Maybe you weren’t an addict…only a “problem” user. But I assure you that there are those that feel they do have a life long disease that requires them to continue in recovery and to abstain in order to continue to live. Anyone that is truly in recovery does not blame anyone or anything for their addiction….accepting it as a disease helps remove the stigma. I’ve often heard “we are not bad people trying to get good…we are sick people trying to get well”.If it means having a sober life or being able to accept a loved ones efforts to turn their lives around, so be it. Its realizing that you do have choices…as long as you don’t “pick up”. The reason it works is because its about personal accountability.. NOT about blame.
I find it very odd that this post has become a thread about AA for years now, even though it’s really about Passages.
I have clean and sober for 12 years didnt take rehab to get me where im at today it took me 12 steps and 12 traditions and working thru those steps and traditions with my sponsor and my support group, thats all thats it. To each their own but never in my life would i fork out 75k for someone to tell me how to stay clean cause i bet you anything thats not how that works.
I’ve been in AA for over 12 years and sober that whole time. When I first came into the program I said to a man that had many years clean and sober, “why do I need these meetings, and my dad quit drinking over 20 years and has never gone to AA”. The man told me AA is for alcoholics of our type. Different strokes for different folks, what works for me, might not be what works for you. But if you’re a alcoholic I hope you find some path that works. And who cares if it’s a disease or not, dying of alcoholism is a long and slow process, unless your lucky and choke on your own vomit or kill yourself driving.
Wow. I am in awe. Unfortunately, I don’t have the time or space to comment on what all is terribly wrong g with this. We are all guilty of giving opinions where we have no experience and that is unfortunate because that is what ends up harming others. What about the ones that relapse and feel so terrible and hopeless because they thought that they were cured and feel that there is no other way. The desperation drives them deeper into their addiction and they die because of their disease? F.Y.I. the definition of ‘disease’ lists none of the things that you describe it as. Its the same as with any other thing that humans go through in life. It is each persons own experience. Not everybody does the same thing the same way or thinks the same or acts the same. That is what we call our own process. It is each individuals opinion.. and my opinion is that your opinions sucks a**.
Chinese healing has thousands of years of proof that it’s beneficial and these things passages Malibu say are valid, it’s not mumbo jumbo.
Healthy body healthy mind. Acupuncture is a known healing art and things like THC and other chemicals can store in the body cells for long periods of time and should be cleansed.
As far as them being the underlying cause for the addiction is just as valid as any other disease caused by lack of vitamins or minerals in the body, so it is diseased based to some extent.
The concept of taking control of what you do or don’t do is part of the healing process, but just like a neurological disease with unknown causes, it’s not always as simple as just taking control.
One may address the symptoms of a problem, but it’s not always possible to just control ones own behaviour when underlying issues are messing with your physical or mental health.
Passages Malibu’s Philosophy of causes is one or more of 4
1 Chemical imbalance
2 Unresolved events from the past
3 Beliefs you hold that are inconsistent with what is true
4 Inability to cope with current conditions.
They believe that addiction is not the primary problem but rather the symptom of a deeper underlying issue, a very valid concept.
Any good psychologist would agree that things like depression, anxiety, emotional upset, etc. can cause people to try and self medicate to escape these feelings.
Depression is known to be caused in many cases by chemical imbalance, if holistic methods are used it can be much better than prescription drugs.
Passages use a physiological and psychological balance, to help people feel good enough to take charge of their own daily lives including whether they need alcohol or drugs.
You are trying to exclude them by only telling part of their therapy methods, they are a well rounded center that is better than depending on some invisible being to make you well and be in control.
As for Scientology, they use pseudo psychology and sociology methods and utilization of electrical impulses of current to show what level of healing ones in and that can be useful, but the audits to become clear are nothing more than a cult brainwashing technique.
To say drug addiction isn’t a disease makes me want to run the other way even farther. That’s ignorant to say. It’s a disease in the way HIV is a disease, it was brought about by a mistake. To tell a heroin addict they made the choice to use everyday is not right, just plain rude and unsympathetic. No, I don’t consider all drug addictions a disease, I’m only positive opioid (narcotic painkillers of the opium origin including heroin) dependency is a disease. It was BY FAR the most painful and longest lasting pain I’ve ever gone through physically or emotionally, it was nearly all physical pain! Not to mention I honestly had no control over my use once I bought a few dosages in one buy!!! By the way, addiction is officially a disease in the United States.
I am a recovering heroin addict, it is a choice to use everyday. Its a hard choice to say no to but it is most definitely a choice. I don’t understand how you can say its not. I went from just on the weekends, to daily,back to few times a week, to suboxin to stopping. You just have to want to get more out of life then a high that isn’t as good as it was a day/week/month/year ago. And there has been many false starts to my stoppjng . But by saying its not a choice just gives addicts more reason to not get clean. Most of our lives we push our problems away and blame others for what has happened to us. By giving us that out, that we aren’t to blame, its something we can’t control Many won’t quit till they are forced or they die.
I was a suicidal, fall down drunk and have been sober for a long time after honestly following a 12 step program. Not going to give the time, I’ll just say that it is over 20 years, which should qualify as “long term” sobriety. I know a number of people with long term sobriety as well, done the same way I did. But everybody thinks they can do it better, don’t they?